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Not a newbie, but confused.....
Luvr4boyz
Please Lord...guide me to my little girl!!
California
Joined 09-05-2007
Posts 1,564
 
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Okay, so If I am doing TBM with my SU at 0+12....how is conception possible when we have no idea the timeframe when the spermies wake up. It seems nearly impossible if we do not know how long they stay immobilized, right? Just a thought.....The last three months I have been doing 0+12 with no success and so I am wondering if it is because 1. maybe the lime has killed my sperm because it is low or 2. because it is too late when I make my attempt because by the time the sperm wake up, my egg is gone!!! So, ladies...what do you think? How do we fix this for next month?
Also, I was wondering if anyone has done SU without doing TBM or is that just plain DUMB? Anyone made the splime higher than 4.5? Ladies I am just thinking out loud...please forgive me!! I am 35 yrs old, have FOUR boys and am trying to be patient, but it is hard, especially if what I am doing is wrong or not working with my body!!! Please excuse all of my questions....I am a deserate mother to four boys wanting so deserately a little girl to complete our family!!! I know that you ALL understand to some degree!!!!
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I'm with ya...had the same thought about splime. I would think under 5 should be good, but Tamara seems to really like it to be under 4.5, The thing is under 5 is what we want our pH after the attempt so....I believe it's the Y spermies that get immobilized because they don't like the pH not the X's.
A thought about if you wanted to add to your attempt. It seems timing isn't as crucial as previously thought, only swaying 60% compared with diet at 80%. I had a change of thought this time so just wanted to suggest it. I'm going to BD for 5 straight days with condom, then on day 2 and 3 before O we will do SU/TBM attempts, continue to BD protected inbetween this and an O+12 attempt. That gives me 3 tries for this cycle while still doing diet, supplements, SU/TBM etc. I think we'll even have DH release once and then use the second sample to further deplete the semen and this is then for X heavy. The stats have shown a high percentage of girls and that's not necessarily with SU.
I know it's a super personal choice but, wanted to throw that out there. Now to get the dang EW's to float!
 2007-my sweet little boy ...would love to give him a sister  pretty please...
BFP!! (12 dpo) and due June 27, 2010.
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Luvr4boyz
Please Lord...guide me to my little girl!!
California
Joined 09-05-2007
Posts 1,564
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I like that thought I might do the same, although what do you mean by having DH release once and then use the second sample to further deplete the semen and this is then for X heavy?
Also, all the sperm freeze...I have looked under the microscope and they all a motionless, so I am confused when they wake up!! Also, the splime is really an issue for me....I hope some TBM success stories pop over hear to help me through this and tell me that 4-4.5 is what I should do!!!!
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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Thanks for posting this...
I tried TBM years ago with no success, I just didn't get pg at all. I'm willing to try it again though...
Good luck to everyone!
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 Luvr4boyz:Also, all the sperm freeze...I have looked under the microscope and they all a motionless, so I am confused when they wake up!!
Yes, they all freeze, but the girls supposedly wake up first. Not a clue when that would happen though.
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Luvr4boyz
Please Lord...guide me to my little girl!!
California
Joined 09-05-2007
Posts 1,564
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Exactly my point Niki!!!! I might just drop the TBM during 0+12 because after all that is supposedly the perfect environment for a girl, right?
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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This had some info on the sperm freezing w/lime or lemon...http://www.abc.net.au/tv/enoughrope/transcripts/s832834.htm
These last 2 are for lemon:
With this link you have to scroll down...http://www.jurology.com/article/PIIS0022534706025936/fulltext#sec7
This is what it says:
Sperm Immobilizing Properties of Lemon Juice
G. N. Clarke, S. G. McCoombe and R. V. Short, Department of Andrology, Royal Women’s Hospital, Victoria, Australia
Fertil Steril 2006; 85: 1529–1530.
The aim of this study was to evaluate the sperm-immobilizing properties of lemon juice to determine if they are consistent with its traditional contraceptive use. It was found that lemon juice supernatant (LJS) has high osmolality (550–60 mOsm) and low pH (2.2–2.6) and that addition of LJS to semen to give a final concentration of 20% v/v reduced the pH from around 8.4 to 4.1. This acidification was associated with irreversible cessation of all sperm movements within 1 minute. In conclusion, lemon juice should be further evaluated for acceptability, safety, and efficacy as a topical vaginal contraceptive agent.
Editorial Comment
Mediterranean women have apparently used lemon juice as a traditional intravaginal contraceptive for centuries. These investigators studied the properties of lemon juice that would render sperm nonfunctional, and found that if lemon juice supernatant were added to semen for a final concentration of 20%, conditions were consistent with irreversible immobilization of sperm within 1 minute. If tolerated, this simple contraceptive clearly merits further study.
This is from wikipedia:
Lemon juice solutions have been shown to immobilize sperm in the laboratory,[8] as has Krest Bitter Lemon drink.[9] While the authors of the Krest Bitter Lemon study suggested its use as a postcoital douche, this is unlikely to be effective, as sperm begin leaving the ejaculate (out of the reach of any douche) within 1.5 minutes of deposition.[10] No published studies appear to have been done on the effectiveness of lemon juice preparations in preventing pregnancy, though they are advocated by some as 'natural' spermicides.[11]
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That sounds like they aren't going to live through the lime/lemon. Or did I read that wrong? If women have been using it as a contraceptive, how could you ever get PG using it. I know that wikipedia article (and we know how reliable wikipedia is) says they don't believe it is very effective, but sure looks to make it difficult to get PG. I had already decided to skip that step, that just confirmed my decision.
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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NikiLyn:
That sounds like they aren't going to live through the lime/lemon. Or did I read that wrong? If women have been using it as a contraceptive, how could you ever get PG using it. I know that wikipedia article (and we know how reliable wikipedia is) says they don't believe it is very effective, but sure looks to make it difficult to get PG. I had already decided to skip that step, that just confirmed my decision.
That's what it sounds like to me too. I am not sure what the ph difference is with lemon and lime though, maybe the lime is not as acidic. Ok, here's a link for that http://jackeden.com/tips/phmat.html, we have to take into account though that with the douche we are diluting the lime.
They didn't go into great detail in the first study which included lime. I would love to see a study or article that says that the sperm regain mobility/motility and that the X sperm recover quicker. Does anyone know of there is one on here somewhere?
In any case it seems like it would be an effective way to reduce sperm count 
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Interesting talk about the lime, don't know what to do...
so the release twice thing I got from under Gender Swaying "jump and dump". It can't be used with abstinance cause that would defeat the purpose of abstinance, but if your BD daily no big deal. On the night your doing an attempt, you BD twice, but throw away the first one. You could also try the first one as a practice. It's the second time that you use his sample for your attempt. Frequent BD favors girls because the semen usually has more X's. This would further deplete the semen therefor more X heavy. Hope that makes sense.....
2007-my sweet little boy ...would love to give him a sister pretty please... BFP!! (12 dpo) and due June 27, 2010.
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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These links are about sperm count and abstinence:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/jun/30/highereducation.sciencenews
http://www.babyhopes.com/articles/abstaining.html
http://www.squidoo.com/cause-Abstinence
These are about frequent ejaculation:
http://www.fertilitycommunity.com/fertility/how-does-frequent-ejaculation-affect-sperm-production.html
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2004-09/01/content_370811.htm
This one is just very interesting info on semen:http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/menshealth/facts/semenandsperm.htm
This is from In-Gender:http://www.in-gender.com/cs/forums/t/67220.aspx
My DH and I cannot seem to decide which way to go. When we checked under a microscope there was more movement after a 7 day abstinence and less movement after 3 days of ejaculation (one time a day).
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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hopefull2009:
Interesting talk about the lime, don't know what to do...
so the release twice thing I got from under Gender Swaying "jump and dump". It can't be used with abstinance cause that would defeat the purpose of abstinance, but if your BD daily no big deal. On the night your doing an attempt, you BD twice, but throw away the first one. You could also try the first one as a practice. It's the second time that you use his sample for your attempt. Frequent BD favors girls because the semen usually has more X's. This would further deplete the semen therefor more X heavy. Hope that makes sense.....
Hey, Hopefull! 
Do you have any links to actual studies (from here or somewhere else) that show where a lower sperm count is more X heavy? I can't get a straight answer on this. I thought that they weren't sure why a lower count equals more X pregnancies and that no matter what the sperm are 50/50. So confused...
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hopefull2009: On the night your doing an attempt, you BD twice, but throw away the first one.
You really don't have to do this. Infact, you may find that it isn't possible. There's no way that would have worked for us.
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Rainne: Do you have any links to actual studies (from here or somewhere else) that show where a lower sperm count is more X heavy? I can't get a straight answer on this. I thought that they weren't sure why a lower count equals more X pregnancies and that no matter what the sperm are 50/50. So confused...
Here's a link to a list of studies. I didn't look to see if that one is specifically there. I would think that there is one. This is under FAQs.
http://www.in-gender.com/cs/forums/t/71062.aspx
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Rainne
Lovin' my babies...
Joined 05-19-2009
Posts 1,529
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NikiLyn:
Rainne: Do you have any links to actual studies (from here or somewhere else) that show where a lower sperm count is more X heavy? I can't get a straight answer on this. I thought that they weren't sure why a lower count equals more X pregnancies and that no matter what the sperm are 50/50. So confused...
Here's a link to a list of studies. I didn't look to see if that one is specifically there. I would think that there is one. This is under FAQs.
http://www.in-gender.com/cs/forums/t/71062.aspx
Thanks! So, it seems like it related to hormones?? I couldn't get a couple of those links to work...maybe we should just do the opposite of whatever we did to get our DS.
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